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When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next year?

The forum for discussion about the Music of The Flower Kings

When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next year?

Postby The Letter M » 12 Jan 2015, 07:24

It seems like the Kings are all really busy this year. Jonas recorded for The Tangent, while he's also working on new Karmakanic stuff, and also a project with Nick D'Virgilio. Hasse is finishing up the new Musical Companion album titled HFMC, which should come out in the coming months. Roine is working on Kaipa Da Capo shows and a new album. And supposedly Tomas is working on something as well.

It seems like the band has been busy and will be for at least the first half of the year between new albums and possibly touring on them.

What are the chances of a new TFK album THIS year? I'd say kind of slim, especially if they're all so busy NOW, they probably won't get back together as The Flower Kings until this fall or winter, and in that case, a new TFK won't arrive until 2016. I'll be OK with an early 2016 release - the wait for it won't be nearly as long as the gap between TSONE and BOE!

-Marc.
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby Chessman » 12 Jan 2015, 16:42

I tend to agree. Can't see anything coming out this year. I suppose they may get together in the autumn, or winter, and start work on something, but I can't see anything being ready till next year, maybe round April or even summer. Still, I'm happy to wait too, always am as long as the finished product is top notch, which it always is with these fellas. :)
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby projeKct » 12 Jan 2015, 19:51

... and I would like to add that all of these side projects are great too! 8-)
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby Björn-Ola » 12 Jan 2015, 22:09

They plan to meet later this year to write material for a new album.
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby progster1 » 12 Jan 2015, 23:21

Whenever the next release comes, I know it will be worth the wait.We can always expect real quality...thats the great thing about these guys...... 8-)
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby progtastic mate » 14 Jan 2015, 15:04

I missed the last tour as it was quite a journey to the closest venue and my prog partner in crime was away on holiday - weren't you progster1. :roll: Looking forward to something hopefully this year
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby wowie » 14 Jan 2015, 15:18

buuujaaaa,
would be great to have a KARMAKANIC tour together with Tomas and Roine.
So they could play Karma, Barracuda and TFK stuff.... isnt that an awesome idea?!!!
:D
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby flowerkingsfan » 14 Jan 2015, 19:28

wowie wrote:buuujaaaa,
would be great to have a KARMAKANIC tour together with Tomas and Roine.
So they could play Karma, Barracuda and TFK stuff.... isnt that an awesome idea?!!!
:D


How about a prog extravaganza with Barracuda, HFMC, Karmakanic then TFK? I'd definitely like to see that show! :D ;)
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby projeKct » 14 Jan 2015, 20:51

flowerkingsfan wrote:How about a prog extravaganza with Barracuda, HFMC, Karmakanic then TFK? I'd definitely like to see that show! :D ;)

It would be the longest show in rock history!!! :twisted:
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby Max Power » 18 Jan 2015, 19:39

This and next year. I hope :D
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby The Letter M » 19 Jan 2015, 05:02

Max Power wrote:This and next year. I hope :D


So, what... a 2-part concept album released as 2 separate discs? I mean, a TON of bands have done this before - Ayreon, Pain of Salvation, Beardfish, Big Big Train - so I wouldn't mind seeing TFK tackle a split-released double album. It would give fans a chance to digest their usual double-album releases a bit easier if released separately (not that releasing 2+ hours of music at once has ever stopped me from digesting it all! lol).

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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby wowie » 19 Jan 2015, 14:28

so lets just get the biggest tour bus you can get and draw lots ... but there have to be three bands minimum in the end ...
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby flowerkingsfan » 19 Jan 2015, 21:45

projeKct wrote:
flowerkingsfan wrote:How about a prog extravaganza with Barracuda, HFMC, Karmakanic then TFK? I'd definitely like to see that show! :D ;)

It would be the longest show in rock history!!! :twisted:


No, the longest show in history would have to have Transatlantic included as well...!!!! :lol:

Everyone would be completely worn out! ;)
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby Max Power » 19 Jan 2015, 21:54

The Letter M wrote:
Max Power wrote:This and next year. I hope :D


So, what... a 2-part concept album released as 2 separate discs? I mean, a TON of bands have done this before - Ayreon, Pain of Salvation, Beardfish, Big Big Train - so I wouldn't mind seeing TFK tackle a split-released double album. It would give fans a chance to digest their usual double-album releases a bit easier if released separately (not that releasing 2+ hours of music at once has ever stopped me from digesting it all! lol).

-Marc.


What about a 2-part concept album released as 2 double albums ;)
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby projeKct » 20 Jan 2015, 05:07

Max Power wrote:This and next year. I hope :D

I was thinking: just release the album on December 31st... :roll:
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby Chessman » 20 Jan 2015, 23:03

I love all the side projects, but for me, when they come together as TFK they can't be beaten. 8-)
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby wowie » 22 Jan 2015, 13:29

yeah, 2 part concept album as 2 doubles, this sounds epic ... :D

or a classic 4 track album ... we never had that for tfk did we?!!
well maybe GoD Disc 1 but that doesnt count.
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby Symfoon » 17 Feb 2015, 11:39

Regarding a new TFK album - There is an interview with (mainly) Jonas published in the latest edition of IoPages,
main subject of this interview is more or less the Barracuda thingy... but a little further into the interview Jonas
reveals that there recently has been a meeting regarding the future of TFK and it was decided then that all members
will meet/join again this spring to see if they can work out some ideas and record music for a new album...
"Nu is het tijd voor de eerste balade van de avond..." (J.Reingold)
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby projeKct » 17 Apr 2015, 11:53

Another glimpse of information from Tomas:

Well , the next TFK happening [tour] must [be] in 2016 since Roine this year, will be on tour with Mr Hackett.
We had an idea to make an album this year [2015] but we had to push it forward to find a better time.

Tomas


I added the [...]
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby The Letter M » 20 Apr 2015, 05:21

projeKct wrote:Another glimpse of information from Tomas:

Well , the next TFK happening [tour] must [be] in 2016 since Roine this year, will be on tour with Mr Hackett.
We had an idea to make an album this year [2015] but we had to push it forward to find a better time.

Tomas


I added the [...]



Makes sense. Tomas has been busy with a couple of things, and Hasse just released an album I'm sure he'll tour on. Jonas has been busy with The Fringe (band with Nick D'Virgilio) and new Karmakanic, and as Tomas has said, Roine's busy, so at this point, I don't expect a new TFK album until 2016, which is fine by me. The last two came out back-to-back so I'm fine with a bit of a longer wait, especially if we get some really good TFK-family stuff this year!!!

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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby hardlanding » 28 Apr 2015, 21:30

On one hand it's a shame we won't get a TFK album sooner, but I'm certainly glad to hear they're planning one for whenever they can arrange it. But maybe we can generate a little activity here in this forum by talking about what we'd like to have happen on this next album. If I could wave my magic wand, I'd wish for 2 things: that (a) they spend this extra time preparing material in advance, rather than generating it in the studio, and (2) they move away from the "play live in the studio" recording technique.

For Desolation Rose, Roine used more of the Transatlantic-style, get-together-in-the-studio and jam out an album in a surprisingly short period of time. It's very collaborative, and proves what amazing musicians they are, but to my mind the song writing wasn't as stellar as albums past. And as for the recording technique, I've found the last 3 albums to be sonically quite lacking. It's frustrating to listen to these albums and have the powerful sections be lost in a highly muddled mix. My hope is for a TFK album that sounds great, and that puts them back at the top of the list of progressive rock bands.
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby Symfoon » 29 Apr 2015, 11:27

hardlanding wrote:On one hand it's a shame we won't get a TFK album sooner, but I'm certainly glad to hear they're planning one for whenever they can arrange it. But maybe we can generate a little activity here in this forum by talking about what we'd like to have happen on this next album. If I could wave my magic wand, I'd wish for 2 things: that (a) they spend this extra time preparing material in advance, rather than generating it in the studio, and (2) they move away from the "play live in the studio" recording technique.

For Desolation Rose, Roine used more of the Transatlantic-style, get-together-in-the-studio and jam out an album in a surprisingly short period of time. It's very collaborative, and proves what amazing musicians they are, but to my mind the song writing wasn't as stellar as albums past. And as for the recording technique, I've found the last 3 albums to be sonically quite lacking. It's frustrating to listen to these albums and have the powerful sections be lost in a highly muddled mix. My hope is for a TFK album that sounds great, and that puts them back at the top of the list of progressive rock bands.


Fully agreed for a 110%.... where have the days of let's say 'Stardust we are' gone? ;) and you are sooo right on the 'sonic' thing my friend!!!
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby projeKct » 29 Apr 2015, 11:41

When was the last release by/with Stolt? I think it was Kaleidoscope, back in January 2014,
and Desolation Rose (more a Stolt composition than Kaleidoscope) was in October 2013....

Then there was a long and silent period (1½ year is "long" when referring to Roine...)

So I guess he must have a LOT of great compositional ideas for the next TFK album!!! ;)
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby wowie » 29 Apr 2015, 16:02

i think they prepare, but thats not the "problem". I think all have their own taste and vision. At some point, you just dont have any more ideas (of a certain kind). So you ask how can i get more ideas... or you have a very specific idea you want to realize ... both can be a way of the dark side too. Anyway, tfk creativity is still hi-def!!
In terms of production, i had a listen to the new ones and the old ones in my car ... and the new ones are really not worse, they even are superior in terms of balancing. Still i know what you mean with sonic and this is maybe because they record it live and one take. Still i cant imagine that they dont do any post-pro. Its also a matter of taste if you underlay the bass drum with four other bass drums and so on... the whole tone of your instrument which relates to your taste and visions.
So its not the thing you play it live really, i think its the way you want it sound in the end which includes a lot of other things.

so this taste and vision is the thing which is shared in the end at the most. Its a kind of a whole summed up thing as it also includes everything else for all sub-divisions.
i guess you can only hope that the tastes and visions progress and build up (i think they do) and that the people have enough order & motivation to surpass their own doings ;) .... or we just hope for some unbelievable luck - the sum of evil and good!

As it comes to progress the style, i belive to think out of the box, not to wirte a workin song in a A B A B C B form or something .... to work with new sounds (which you can find in other genres and stuff) ... work with more spaces in your music and so on .... all that defines experiemental rock ... ... this is very very important, important to do something really new and epic... just btw
Another way is to sum up all intense good things from the past and fuse it together. Coheed & Cambria IV is a good exapmple for this.

nP
Queen - One Vison
;)
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby Bargamon » 30 Apr 2015, 18:09

Roine been quiet for some time. The Agent of Mercy thing I hope is done. Nads kind of creeps me out in the "Revisited" thing. To me its Kapipa with a phil collins sound a like but looks like a man dressed in drag trying to look like robert plant.
Personally I like when Roine sings. He is not a great singer but his stuff usually holds up best. Just my opinion. Yes, I like Hasse very much. The two are great togther!
Glad he is branching out with Hackett and playing some bass. Maybe a new "GTR"? "Squackett"? "STROINE"? "HACKSTOLT"?

Saw the first few minutes of Hackets "Wolfflight" video and just LOL'd! What is he thinking?

Dont get me wrong, I love Hackett and need to listen to the rest of the album. I have lots of Hackett albums I don't listen to. I buy them out of love but then it falls off my list fast. I like the old stuff, but appreciate he tries.

Back TFK's, I'd like for them to take some risks and go another direction. I realize its a commercial venture and fans want more of the old stuff, but its been a while. I actually like Adam and Eve coming off of the also unique "unfold the future".

Paradox Hotel I thought they took some risks but didn't work. I give them props for trying. Its been 9 years since Paradox? Wow!!!! 21 years the band has been recording!! Wow!
At this point I'd rather they try and fail then put out more homogenized commerial safe diluted music. The last few recordings have been OK but nothing that stands out.
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby flowerkingsfan » 30 Apr 2015, 20:49

Thanks for your observations, Bargamon. I agree with a lot of what you said- especially about Agents of Mercy and Steve Hackett's newer stuff. I also think that TFK's last few recordings have been less memorable, in my opinion the darker stuff does not compare to the melodic symphonic prog of the past. I like Paradox Hotel and The Sum of No Evil quite a bit, but gravitate toward the earlier stuff generally. Maybe it's because of the optimism and positive outlook. Not sure what you mean by another direction... Roine seems to have darkened quite a bit since his solo Wall Street Voodoo album, which is great nevertheless.

Maybe this tour with Steve Hackett will be some relief from having to front a band- and maybe he can get a different outlook to stimulate his songwriting and ideas for the future.
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby hardlanding » 01 May 2015, 18:18

flowerkingsfan wrote:I like Paradox Hotel and The Sum of No Evil quite a bit, but gravitate toward the earlier stuff generally.

When Paradox Hotel came out, I was originally a bit disappointed, but I have to say that album has really grown on me; it has a unique sound and feel, and has stood the test of time to be a great album. The last 3 albums since then (SoNE, BoE, DR) all have a certain sameness to them IMHO.

flowerkingsfan wrote:Roine seems to have darkened quite a bit since his solo Wall Street Voodoo album, which is great nevertheless.

Glad you mentioned WSV - I love this album. I remember back on the Spock's Beard forum (years ago when that was a super active board, and was the place to be!) I was one of the few who promoted WSV, but I always had to warn people "WSV is *not* prog, it's blues rock". I still listen to it quite a bit. (And sonically it surpasses all 3 of the last TFK albums, grr....)

flowerkingsfan wrote:Maybe this tour with Steve Hackett will be some relief from having to front a band- and maybe he can get a different outlook to stimulate his songwriting and ideas for the future.

My thoughts exactly; you have to wonder how touring as a supporting musician (and a bassist no less!) will affect his musical interests. It's funny to see how the prog world is interconnected, and Roine's at the center here. Translantic does a cover of Genesis (Giant Hogweed), then they meet Steve Hackett doing a one-off live performance of that, then Steve has Roine play on *Steve's* version of Giant Hogweed (on Genesis Revisited II), and Roine knows Nad Sylvan and Steve ends up using him as vocalist for a now 3-year ongoing concert tour, and now Roine is playing with Steve on this same ongoing tour.

Bargamon wrote:The Agent of Mercy thing I hope is done. Nads kind of creeps me out in the "Revisited" thing.

The first AoM album was a complete letdown, and didn't hold my interest at all. The 2nd AoM album was the same thing. I'm not even sure why I tried the 3rd album (Black Forest), but I have to say, it's *great*. I can listen to that one over and over (and I have); not only is it very listenable, it's very *coherent*; it works as an entire album. I have continued to listen to it far more than any of the previous 3 TFK albums. I think this just supports my initial post, which is that if Roine spends time composing material before recording, he can still come up with amazing stuff, and create *memorable* albums. When TFK re-forms, I can only hope they can be as strong as Black Forest. That being said, I also have no idea what to expect from the next Agents of Mercy (and now that Roine and Nad are on tour together, it would make sense that they could finally get around to that...). I guess we'll find out if "Black Forest" was an exception, and they go back to the style of their first 2 albums (ugh), or whether they continue with the energetic, funky, dark, tuneful music like Black Forest.

Frankly, the "related bands" have outclassed The Flower Kings over the last few years. Black Forest (IMHO) was great, and Karmakanic has just been stellar. Both "Who's the Boss..." and "In A Perfect World" have great music, far more memorable than the recent TFK albums. It shows that Jonas really holds his own in terms of prog composition.

If I could wave my magic wand, I'd love for Roine to take TFK in a slightly more jazz/fusion direction - I really enjoy Kilimanjaro Secret Brew, and I'd love for him to bring some of that energy into TFK.
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby projeKct » 03 May 2015, 23:25

Wow, great post! You make a lot of sense!

More jazz in TFK would be nice.

The last HFMC is very good too.

Agents of Mercy, well, I like some tracks of the first two albums, but Black Forest is clearly the winner here. I even bought it twice (first edition, then the remix). After that, Roine had talked about a live release, but... who knows...

Karmakanic keeps improving with each album. Hoping the next one will be able to top "In a Perfect World"... not an easy thing to do!!

Maybe the next TFK release should be called: "Unfold the Past"... ;)
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby Symfoon » 04 May 2015, 16:36

wowie wrote:In terms of production, i had a listen to the new ones and the old ones in my car ... and the new ones are really not worse, they even are superior in terms of balancing.

Yes you are right they sound superior because they were produced to sound superior on car-stereo, ipad, pc, laptop, walkman, MP3 players..... etc. but they actually don't sound right on any good
(or expensive) hifiset in your livingroom.

A good friend of mine complained to Jonas Reingold last year about the rather horrible soundquality of the Karmakanic live album.... and Jonas told him that it probably was caused by his 'vintage
sound preference'.... ;)

Just a few weeks ago he did the same about the overall sound of the new ELP re-release of Trilogy (done by Jacko Jackzyck) and it was actually our friend Andy Tillison who mailed him the following
on 'soundproduction in today's modern world' :

"hello Robin - as I say, I haven't heard the album in its new form, and I wasn't involved in the production - just in the identification of certain sections. I need to also be careful as this job was done by a friend of mine and I have no intention of criticising his work publicly. Compression is often added to remasters, as it can make the music appear louder and more forceful which often affirms it as "better". It's a common occurrence - one which we in The Tangent have struggled with for years while trying to lessen our use of compression during a peiod which is now known as "The Loudness War". Throughout the past 10 - 15 years people have been making and remaking records with a view to keeping their apparent level HIGH, so that when played in a playlist YOUR record will not sound quieter than another. At first you may think this is rather a puerile game for us to play, and you might wonder why musicians suddenly started doing this. The actual answer is that it's the LISTENER who changed the way they listened - in that people tend now to play from playlists on their Ipods, phones computers and other gadgets. As the maximum level attainable in digital formats without digital distortion is 0db it didn't take long in that "war" for 0db being reached for almost the entire duration of the song. Listen, for example, to any tracks from Muse's "The Origin Of Symmetry" or the Mars Volta's "Deloused in the Comatarium". Even quiet sections of this album are very loud and the result is that the difference between loud and soft is greatly reduced musically. The compression ruins the dynamic feel of the music. But as well as playlists, there are other huge reasons why, in the modern world, people would want to compress their records. Nearly every radio station you have ever heard is compressing their output heavily for that same reason, and the reason is that nowadays, people usually listen to music while they are doing something else. Perhaps they are in a bar, driving in a car, on a plane, hoovering etc, and in all these situations there is a NOISE LEVEL. Compression makes sure that, say you are, for reasons beyond my understanding, listening to an uncompressed recording of "The Rite Of Spring" while you are vaccuum cleaning your living room. You will be able to hear all the louder parts that manage to get over the top of your Hoover, but you won't hear the quieter sections, because the hoover is louder. But a highly compressed record will get through all of it. It relies on psycho acoustics for you to determine that an acoustic guitar section is a lot quieter than a full metal section - even though the difference between the two has been substantially reduced. I must confess that, in the past, I have NOT liked the over use of compression at all and The Tangent have been working since the beginning to gradually reduce the amount that we use. For this reason if you were to listen to the original "The Music That Died Alone" album, you'd find that after listening to that one, our new album sounded quieter by comparison. You'd probably want to turn your amplifier up a little to compensate. Steven Wilson has gradually been reducing it too, from the hugely hugely over loud "In Absentia" album recorded during the height of the Loudness war, to the far more dynamically ranging "Raven". . I personally do not like many of the remasters that I have heard because they crush the dynamic range of the music. Others are wooed by the new volume levels and extra treble and prefer these recordings to the uncompressed originals. I prefer to listen to the original mixes intended by the artists in the first place. The closest to what was originally recorded and heard in the studio on the day those albums were finished is usually the CD - providing the CD was mastered correctly at the time, the trouble is, a lot of the first back catalogue ones were not when they first appeared in the 80s. Led Zep, ELP and many other artists did not get the thorough job they deserved during the first rush to get all back titles available on CD during that time, when every CD mastering studio in the world must have been worked off their feet. There were probably no members of Van Der Graaaf there to supervise the transfer of the original tapes to CD - the band had been defunct for years and the record company who owned the music to start with had probably dissolved and been bought by virgin by then... that period was the period that put he whole "Vinyl Is Better" argument into our minds. In the end, it wasn't the format that was a problem. It was simply too many CDs being mastered at the same time, with no care or due attention and no input from the artists themselves. There was also the question of where the master tapes had been kept for the past 10 years... whether the heads on those taperecorders had been correctly aligned for the CD transfer. In the case of ELP's Brain Salad Surgery, i have yet to hear it sound "As it used to" on any digital version. This is NOT to fault the medium of CD which is excellent, but to say that the original TAPE they made in 1973 has eiether lost a lot, or it's never been properly done. I can't include the new Jakko BSS in that as I have not heard it."
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Re: When will the next TFK album come? This year? Or next ye

Postby projeKct » 05 May 2015, 02:15

Symfoon wrote:Just a few weeks ago he did the same about the overall sound of the new ELP re-release of Trilogy (done by Jacko Jackzyck) and it was actually our friend Andy Tillison who mailed him the following
on 'soundproduction in today's modern world' :

"hello Robin - as I say, I haven't heard the album in its new form, and I wasn't involved in the production - just in the identification of certain sections. I need to also be careful as this job was done by a friend of mine and I have no intention of criticising his work publicly. Compression is often added to remasters, as it can make the music appear louder and more forceful which often affirms it as "better". It's a common occurrence - one which we in The Tangent have struggled with for years while trying to lessen our use of compression during a peiod which is now known as "The Loudness War". Throughout the past 10 - 15 years people have been making and remaking records with a view to keeping their apparent level HIGH, so that when played in a playlist YOUR record will not sound quieter than another. At first you may think this is rather a puerile game for us to play, and you might wonder why musicians suddenly started doing this. The actual answer is that it's the LISTENER who changed the way they listened - in that people tend now to play from playlists on their Ipods, phones computers and other gadgets. As the maximum level attainable in digital formats without digital distortion is 0db it didn't take long in that "war" for 0db being reached for almost the entire duration of the song. Listen, for example, to any tracks from Muse's "The Origin Of Symmetry" or the Mars Volta's "Deloused in the Comatarium". Even quiet sections of this album are very loud and the result is that the difference between loud and soft is greatly reduced musically. The compression ruins the dynamic feel of the music. But as well as playlists, there are other huge reasons why, in the modern world, people would want to compress their records. Nearly every radio station you have ever heard is compressing their output heavily for that same reason, and the reason is that nowadays, people usually listen to music while they are doing something else. Perhaps they are in a bar, driving in a car, on a plane, hoovering etc, and in all these situations there is a NOISE LEVEL. Compression makes sure that, say you are, for reasons beyond my understanding, listening to an uncompressed recording of "The Rite Of Spring" while you are vaccuum cleaning your living room. You will be able to hear all the louder parts that manage to get over the top of your Hoover, but you won't hear the quieter sections, because the hoover is louder. But a highly compressed record will get through all of it. It relies on psycho acoustics for you to determine that an acoustic guitar section is a lot quieter than a full metal section - even though the difference between the two has been substantially reduced. I must confess that, in the past, I have NOT liked the over use of compression at all and The Tangent have been working since the beginning to gradually reduce the amount that we use. For this reason if you were to listen to the original "The Music That Died Alone" album, you'd find that after listening to that one, our new album sounded quieter by comparison. You'd probably want to turn your amplifier up a little to compensate. Steven Wilson has gradually been reducing it too, from the hugely hugely over loud "In Absentia" album recorded during the height of the Loudness war, to the far more dynamically ranging "Raven". . I personally do not like many of the remasters that I have heard because they crush the dynamic range of the music. Others are wooed by the new volume levels and extra treble and prefer these recordings to the uncompressed originals. I prefer to listen to the original mixes intended by the artists in the first place. The closest to what was originally recorded and heard in the studio on the day those albums were finished is usually the CD - providing the CD was mastered correctly at the time, the trouble is, a lot of the first back catalogue ones were not when they first appeared in the 80s. Led Zep, ELP and many other artists did not get the thorough job they deserved during the first rush to get all back titles available on CD during that time, when every CD mastering studio in the world must have been worked off their feet. There were probably no members of Van Der Graaaf there to supervise the transfer of the original tapes to CD - the band had been defunct for years and the record company who owned the music to start with had probably dissolved and been bought by virgin by then... that period was the period that put he whole "Vinyl Is Better" argument into our minds. In the end, it wasn't the format that was a problem. It was simply too many CDs being mastered at the same time, with no care or due attention and no input from the artists themselves. There was also the question of where the master tapes had been kept for the past 10 years... whether the heads on those taperecorders had been correctly aligned for the CD transfer. In the case of ELP's Brain Salad Surgery, i have yet to hear it sound "As it used to" on any digital version. This is NOT to fault the medium of CD which is excellent, but to say that the original TAPE they made in 1973 has eiether lost a lot, or it's never been properly done. I can't include the new Jakko BSS in that as I have not heard it."


Wow, that's a lot of info!

Well, I'm very concerned about this loudness war...

In one of my media players (foobar2000), I have a plugin called Dynamic Range Meter.

I've been testing some albums while reading the Andy Tillison post above.

The DR scale is from 1 to 20:
1 to 7 is considered BAD, because the dynamic range is low
8 to 13 is OKAY (but 8 is still much worse than 13)
14 to 20 is GOOD / VERY GOOD

http://dr.loudness-war.info/

So for TFK albums, we have:
Banks of Eden 7
Desolation Rose 8
Space Revolver 8
The Sum of No Evil 8
Stardust We Are 9-9 *
Unfold the Future (promo version) 9-9 *
Flower Power 10-9 *
Adam & Eve 10
Back in the World of Adventures 10
Retropolis 10
The Rainmaker 10
Paradox Hotel 11-9 *
Unfold the Future 10-11 *

* CD1-CD2

So the best DR goes to UTF, and we can see (hear) that the last 3 albums have lesser DR.

In comparison, the Tangent:
first album: The Music That Died Alone 7
last album: A Spark in the Aether 10

Steven Wilson, chronologically:
Insurgentes 6
Grace for Drowning 12-13
The Raven That Refused to Sing 10
Hand. Cannot. Erase 11

Muse:
Origin Of Symmetry 7
Black Holes and Revelations 5

And Metallica's Death Magnetic is a... 3 !!! :shock:
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